Building Resilience: Timeless Tips from Experienced Professionals -  Episode 1: David R

Note: transcription provided by Otter AI. Intro and outro music produced with Suno AI.

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Episode transcript:

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Bethany: All right, welcome everybody to building resilience, timeless tips from experienced professionals. Just as a recap, here's how this works. This is a podcast where I Bethany Rankin interview seasoned professionals who have successfully navigated the business world or have recently retired on their tips for resiliency in the workplace. For young professionals, we have four segments. The first is career trajectory, where we'll hear a bit about the industry they were in, how they worked their way up to their last or current position, and the challenges they faced. The second segment is defining resilience. We'll hear about their definition of resilience and how it's changed over the years and pivotal moments that help define how they view and practice resilience. Third segment is tangible and timeless tips. We'll hear their main tips for young professionals and building resilience. And fourth is your favorite piece of advice, where we'll hear their favorite piece of advice they've received and how it's helped shape their current outlook on resilience in the workplace. And with that, let's begin

 

Bethany: All right, and welcome everybody to Episode One of building resilience, timeless tips from experienced professionals. Today on the podcast, we have David R with us. David, thank you so much for joining us today.

 

David: Thank you. It's good to be here.

 

Bethany: Good to have you here. So let's dive right in with segment number one career trajectory. So David, can you tell us a little bit about your career trajectory and the industry or industries you are in?

 

David: Being that I'm an older professional, there have been a number of different industries that I've worked in I'll start sort of where the original jobs began to come and kind of lead into where I where I finished off. So in my early days, I worked in retail ski shop. I drove a appliance delivery truck part time. I did do work as a general laborer in a couple of summers at a company where my father worked in Montreal, my first serious job, I worked a couple of years at a major pharmaceutical company in their quality assurance department, inspecting and testing packaging and raw materials used in making various vitamins and prescription drugs.

 

In 1977 I moved to Ontario and followed basically my older brother through a number of mechanical jobs. My brother was very mechanically inclined. I had the ability, not technically, the desire, to do that, but it was where the work was right. So I did end up working in the automotive industry for a number of years. I worked in aircraft manufacturing plant. Also worked in underground mining equipment building where I was an assembly mechanic at that company, I had the opportunity to move out of the hands on mechanical and into materials planning and shop floor control. So stepping away from the tools, this is where I started to follow my own career path.

 

So from there, I developed affinity for working with numbers, planning and moving things through shop floor. I took a few courses and was lucky enough to get a job with railway maintenance company as their materials manager. I worked there for a number of years, still, at no point yet, did I find that I had anybody that I would call a mentor. After working there for a number of years, I moved on to while working at a local electrical utility as a material planner, and it was at this point that I probably met my first mentor, someone who was actually interested in how well I did what my capabilities were, and actually worked to help me align the work I was going to be doing with the size my capability. During that time, he made sure that I had those opportunities, and eventually I was rewarded with a number of advancements and promotions. While there, I developed an understanding of materials management computer systems, and was offered the role of Supervisor of material systems, still under the guidance of the same mentor, after about 11 years, there a few promotions and a rare double step pay Increase, I left to join a major utility consulting firm. Again, I was lucky enough to develop a strong relationship with the VP who hired me, and under his guidance and support, I supported a utility billing system implementation in New Brunswick, and also led a number of government proposals for contracting work. I did some independent contracting work after leaving that consulting firm and eventually returned to the local utility as a contractor on their utility billing systems implementation team. A lot of the relationships I had while I was there sort of rekindled, and I learned their new system, and I became a teaching resource for their staff, but the same manager gave me some other opportunities, allowed me to extend my time there, and I developed a relationship with the Engineering and IT staff and built a series of reports to show when the integrated systems were out of sync as that role was coming to an end, the manager put me in touch with a lead at an electricity retailer. They were looking for a project management lead.

 

This opportunity turned into a lead role on their utility billing system in Tulsa, Oklahoma and Dallas, Texas. Again, I built a strong working relationship with the Vice President in Dallas, and he led that program to successful implementation. When I returned to the home office in Mississauga, I worked for a new VP and built a solid relationship with Him, delivering projects and delivering business acquisitions for the company across Ontario.

 

Bethany: Wow. Well, it sounds like you have a lot of experience in a lot of different provinces and a lot of different industries.

 

David: Certainly bounced around a lot, yeah.

 

Bethany: Well, thank you so much for joining us today, it's great to have your insight. So can you tell us a little bit more about your last or most senior level role?

 

David: Sure, after leaving the electricity retailer, I joined a different local utility to manage their smart metering application in the city of Mississauga. That role was where I benefited the most from having a mentoring relationship with my direct manager and in different roles and using their guidance and support. Eventually, I became the manager of the metering department, and through amalgamation, I was promoted into the senior manager for data collection across the new amalgamated Company, which was now serving over a million customers in the Greater Toronto Area. And that's really the role that I retired from at the end of my career.

 

Bethany: Okay, great, managing a lot of different people, huh? (laughs)

 

David: Yeah, very much. (laughs)

 

Bethany: So what lessons did you learn from your job transitions or shifts in your career?

 

David: Well, through the various roles I've had, and as you've heard, there's been a lot of them, I've learned business relationships flourish when they're conducted with integrity and honesty. Communication is key to building healthy and beneficial relationships, not only with those in a position to mentor, but also those on all levels of an organization, supporting and being supported builds resiliency through experience.

 

Bethany: For sure, what would be your tips on either promoting clear communication or enhancing your clear communication when working with different people?

 

David: There were a number of situations where you would take a particular approach to something, and I would sit down with my mentor and tell him the approach I was going to take, and he would critique it back to me and offer some other options that generally I thought worked very well between the two of us, because we ended up using a hybrid of the of the both of the approaches that we had both talked about, which was very successful for both of us. Leading into communication, it needs to be clear. Coaching, coaching it in terminology that's too soft does not get the message through. And you see that a lot, if you're doing a lot of presentations, people want to know the facts. They want to understand it. And if it's not done in a manner where it is easily understood, then the message doesn't get across, and you really don't accomplish what you were trying to

 

Bethany: Yeah, for sure, and that's something that I see in my, my own job now, or just in my own career path. But clear communication is so key, because you know, if you can't get your ideas across, you could have great ideas, but if you can't get them across in a clear and concise way, then they could just be, you know, lost in the sauce. (laughs)

 

David: Very much so (laughs)

 

Bethany: Yeah, great tip. So moving on to some of the challenges you faced. What challenges did you encounter as you advanced in your career, and how did you overcome those?

 

David: Well, one of them, I would say, if you're working in various organizations, there can be people in positions of power who it appears more contrary to the goals of the team you're on, whether that's their personal agenda or they're just difficult people to deal with. I ran into one of those types of people my early days at the local utility during a presentation I was given, he challenged the facts, the numbers that I have reported, and even went so far as to say that he knew the numbers were wrong. And I went back after that presentation, and I reviewed my numbers and confirmed that they were all quite correct. And then I sat down with my manager, again open communication, and brought it up to him that this other person had challenged those numbers, and said he found them to be incorrect, yet the numbers are validated, gaining his support. He actually went through to the vice president of the company, who was in the presentation, and explained to him that no, in fact, this other person was wrong, and that the numbers that were presented were correct. So in gaining that, that support from both my manager and the higher VP, you know, it helped to get you to understand that sometimes other people, while it appears they're working against you, they're more trying to build themselves up than trying to tear you down.

 

And that was one of the lessons I learned during that session, was I'm not one of those people who can think on their feet. I need to have the facts in my hand in order to speak to them. If I have that, I can speak to them. But if I'm questioned off the cuff like that, it's just it's not one of my strong suits to be able to just come back and fire back. So I knew that was something that was going to come back again in the future of my career, that I needed to have an appropriate amount of time to discern what the facts were, and then I was good, yeah.

 

Bethany: Well, I think that's also such an important piece of advice, just kind of like, you know, navigating your way through the workplace, and learning how to advocate for yourself in these situations, you know, because it can be hard when you're put on the spot and you're dealing with, you know, a difficult person or an awkward situation like that, where you're called out in front of a group, or, you know, if somebody's trying to embarrass you, or whatever it might be. But advocating for yourself either then or later is so important

 

David: and it was very unexpected to have to have the data I was presenting challenged like that. So I'm sure I looked like a deer in the headlights when he said, I know those numbers are wrong because I knew them to be right, but I didn't have it readily available to be able to present to say, here's where the numbers come from. So they are true. So yeah, it is definitely a learning experience.

 

Bethany: Yeah, great. Thank you so much for sharing. And with that, we will move on to segment number two.

 

Bethany: great. So welcome back to segment number two, defining resilience. Your definition of resilience now and throughout the years. So, David, how do you define resilience at work?

 

David: I would define resilience at work as being flexible, understanding the need for change, accepting that change and continuing to work toward the end goal. Change isn't always easy, but is a necessary part of life and work, and requires resilience to accept it and build on.

 

Bethany: Great. Thank you so much for sharing. Now, how would you say your definition of resilience has changed from the beginning of your career to now?

 

David: Well, I mean, it's funny, but early on, I would say my definition would have been rather non-existent, just entering into the business world doing what needed to be done. You weren't really thinking about, what are all these challenges that are coming my way, that I'm going to have to, you know, work, work through, around and absorb. Yeah. So I would have taken a lot of things personally back then, even though they weren't intended that way. Throughout my working career, I've been exposed to many situations that require a level of resilience, as opposed to resistance in order to be successful, many of those who I would categorize as mentors provided me with insight to deal with the change in difficult situations, thereby helping me build to my current definition situations like I mentioned in the previous segment

 

Bethany: Yeah. Well, I think having a good mentor definitely has changed my definition of resilience too. You know, I had some bosses in the past that everything was, you know, like such a big deal. And, you know, it was chaotic all the time. And in my current position, you know, I have bosses that are so supportive and have really helped shape my definition of resilience right now, in terms of, you know, like taking things as they come and, you know, working through things as a team and making sure you know, you're taken care of, you know, mentally and emotionally. And you know, things might seem like a big deal, but you know, if you break them down to pieces or talk them through as a group or whatever it might be like, there's always a solution to things and element of communication.

 

David: Yeah, for sure.

 

Bethany: So, yeah, I definitely think having a good mentor and a good working environment is so important to also, you know, building up your own definition of resilience and to build your resilience as well. Yeah, great. So would you be able to describe a key milestone or milestones in your career that contributed to your definition of resilience?

 

David: Sure, I mean job changes for any reason, whether it's a layoff or being let go or it just being time to move on. All help to build resilience, taking past experiences with you, building and developing your work, personality and learning along the way all helped to develop that resilience. I wouldn't say there was a single event that led to sort of an epiphany of resilience, but a slower construct of resilience built over years in different roles, working for and with different people. I think that all contributed to my definition of resilience.

 

Bethany: Awesome, yeah, even just in my own career, like I'm still pretty early on. But I agree with you, I don't think there's any one defining moment. I think there's definitely been some tough moments for me, but I think in terms of my own resilience now, it's been a collection or an accumulation of a lot of tiny events and and just how my, you know, mentors have dealt with things and seeing how they practice or show resilience at work, and kind of, making a mental note of that too. So I definitely agree it's built over time.

 

David: Yes.

 

Bethany: So now, in what ways did setbacks or failures redirect your career path?

 

David: Well, understanding my own personal abilities and finding roles have built on those capabilities was a key turning point, as I mentioned, even though I had the ability to do mechanical jobs that I did early in my career, it was only when I had the opportunity to move into operations planning and project management, I began to earnestly build a career path. So while it's not a setback, it did provide a new direction, moving from shop floor mechanic with tools in hand to planning the work that would provide instances where my career path might change or be driven by other setbacks that I had yet to experience. I accepted an IT based role at one point, which did not pan out that well, and I was let go from a role as a Vice President with a software company when the President and I didn't see eye to eye, it was at that point that was a trajectory change that moved me more into a role that aligned with my experiences and put me on a successful path into project management.

 

Bethany: Great, well, sounds like you know when one door closes, another door opens, and it led you to where you were meant to be.

 

David: Yeah, very much.

 

Bethany: So, so now you had mentioned a little bit about mentorship before and kind of throughout our interview, but how did mentorship or guidance shape your career path and your definition of resilience?

 

David: Yeah, I mean, developing business acumen is it's critical to having a successful career. And working under the guidance of some mentors in my career allowed me to experience much like you were just saying, their understanding and their lessons that they learned through their own careers, and they helped me to build resilience by modeling some of those things that that they had shown me that I would need to be successful going forward

 

Bethany: Awesome. So then later on in your career, how did you cultivate or foster resilience in your team or your workplace?

 

David: Sure. I mean, partly based on that, my previous response, yeah. You know, as a supervisor and manager, I tried to emulate and incorporate some of the things my mentors had provided to me. I was always open to conversations with my staff or members of my team, and not just during the annual review that sometimes happens, but throughout the year. I work with my staff to understand their career path desires and to coach and support those desires by suggesting or recommending various educational options, optional internal courses, and looking for opportunities to allow them to be involved in areas that would help them grow and experience the roles they were interested in performing.

 

One of my mentors would always coach me to perform the duties of a role beyond my current role. And the time came and the position opened up that incorporated those roles, people would kind of look and go, I thought he already did that. And thereby making the transition or promotion easier to justify. I use the same approach with my own staff, challenging them to do more than the defined role, to prepare them for future advancement.

 

Bethany: Yeah, it's great. I mean, I haven't managed any kind of senior level staff yet, but I have managed some students in my time, some Master’s students. And, you know, when I work with students, I always ask them what they're interested in, in terms of, like, building up their career. You know, I've had students that have come to me with a problem or an issue, and I always say that we can work through it together as a team, you know - doing regular check ins, whatever it might be, and asking them again, like, how they want to grow their career, or, build their experience, and how I can support them in that way.

 

So I think, mentorship, it's such an important thing to receive and it's so important to have a good mentor, and then it's so important to pass that along, too, and kind of create that same environment. Because I know for me, the good mentors that I've had really set the stage for how I provide mentorship to my students.

 

David: Yes, great

 

Bethany: Great, well, thank you so much. And with that, we will head into segment three.

 

Bethany: All right, so that three tangible and timeless tips, your tips for young professionals. So David, first off, what strategies do you or did you use to maintain a positive mindset during difficult times of work?

 

David: Sure, during difficult times, I found discussing situations with my peers and my direct manager and my mentor to be very helpful. Sometimes just sounding out the problems can help you develop the solutions or an approach to them. They can be very helpful in resolving those issues that are causing the difficulties. Discussing issues with others, gaining different perspectives allows you to gain a stronger, well thought out and rounded response to a difficult situation and can help them turn positive.

 

Bethany: Yeah, for sure. So I think coming back to that clear communication tip there, yeah (laughs)

 

David: Yeah (laughs)

 

Bethany: So now, did you, or do you employ any daily habits that help build or maintain your resilience?

 

David: Sure, one of the key things, I think, is not to take things personally. Times arise where you may feel negative responses directed at you, when it's more the reaction of someone else's either lack of understanding or mistrust of a situation. When possible, open ended questions like you don't look convinced, Is there something more you're looking for? Or if the situation is too tense, you wait and you talk it out with your manager, your mentor, gain their additional perspective, and then possibly approach a person privately to discuss. And as I said, communication is key

 

Bethany: yeah, for sure. All right, great. And I think that that piece of advice, don't take things personally, is so important, because, you know, sometimes you meet people and they could be the nicest person, but they just communicate very bluntly or maybe they mean well, and it just comes across harshly, or whatever it might be. So people definitely communicate in different ways.

 

David: Definitely.

 

Bethany: And you know, it's not always about you. Sometimes, you know, they might be going through their own thing. And I've seen that tip or whatever, multiple times on Tiktok advice videos or whatever it might be, and you never know what somebody's going through, so you just got to do your own thing. Okay, moving on. So what advice would you give to young professionals about bouncing back from failure or missed opportunities?

 

David: Right - failure for lack of a better way to phrase it, is a learning experience.

 

Bethany: Yeah

 

David: You take the lesson you learned, you tuck it in your mind's filing system, and you use it to avoid or resolve future issues that are similar in nature, in everything you do, you have to take the lesson - resilience doesn't come from a single episode or a single failure or a single setback. It comes from living through those things and learning from them to build a better view.

 

Bethany: Yeah, for sure, I think that's so important. And I think another key lesson in there is like not to ruminate on your failures. You know, don't just keep thinking about them. You're just gonna make it worse, dig yourself into a hole. You gotta learn and move on. And like you said, file that away. It kind of reminds me of like burnt toast theory, if you've heard of that.

 

So there's this very popular theory going around on Tiktok right now, about, you know, if you burn your toast in the morning, maybe it saves you from, you know, something bad that's going to happen later. You know, you spend that extra time making a new piece of toast, or whatever it might be, and it saves you from something, you know, bad or whatever it might be, something that's not for you. And it kind of reminds me of that in a way, you know, like one door closes another door opens, you know, maybe that's your burnt toast there. You know, it's hard to take failure, but you know that's your burnt toast, but then you get another piece of toast, and maybe that's even better. You know, who knows? So burnt toast theory. (laughs)

 

David:  Yeah (laughs)

 

Bethany: Moving on. So burnout is a very hot topic these days. How can young professionals balance ambition and resilience to avoid burnout?

 

David: Yeah, that's a it's a very interesting balancing act. Burnout was a very real issue in the management consulting professional. When I started, I had a conversation with a senior consultant at the firm, and they told me, plan on two years and get out. That was what was considered a stepping stone on your career path related to management consulting, because the stress levels were so high. They also said having this on your resume is a good thing. It's a high stress, high pressure job required close to 24 hour dedication. Traveling to your job in another province was expected to be done on your own time. Hours at the client were as many as you needed to do to get the job done.

 

And there was, there was no nine to five in the early days of your career. You shouldn't take on too much more than time will allow. Keep in mind your own personal and physical requirements, health is priority one. Take care of yourself. Yes, you may be young and energetic now, but high output levels are only sustainable for the short term. Work hard, but mind your health.

 

Bethany: Yeah, I think you know, work life balance is so important.

 

David: And you know, it can definitely also be very difficult

 

Bethany: It can be, yeah, it's true. And I think that also comes back to, you know, having good mentors and good people to work for and supportive people in your life. Because, you know, you need to have those breaks and that separation too, you know. I mean, like you said, high levels of output are only possible for a short period of time, but you're going to burn yourself out if you're doing it for the long term. You know, you got to work hard, play hard, and take your breaks, you know, because it's physically and mentally draining if you're always just at, you know, going at a 10 and never kind of letting yourself rest.

 

So what tips would you give young professionals in terms of cultivating or fostering resilience within their teams at work?

 

David: I would recommend they get to know their team members. Yeah, team building events are helpful, but they only go so far as to building that dynamic, you try to ensure everyone feels that they're part of the group. Again, communicate. Try to understand their goals to a certain extent, so that you can empathize with them and let them know you're there to help them be successful as well.

 

Bethany: Great. Yeah, sounds good. Yeah. I would say it's so important to go beyond those, like team building things, because those can sometimes be a little cheesy, but it's like those one on one conversations that you have with people, where you really get to know them and their interests, and, you know, see their personality more for sure.

 

David: Some of those team building things, people aren't really as relaxed as they could be like you say, you get more of their personality, for sure.

 

Bethany: So then moving on. So we talked about resilience, but I think another important part of maintaining your mental health is also knowing when to walk away from either a toxic environment or a job that isn't right for you. So what would you say are some things to consider if someone is contemplating either sticking it out or finding out their job?

 

David: I mean, in a toxic situation, it can be pretty difficult to make the fight or flight decision. Many things need to be understood before making a choice like that. What is the condition? How is it affecting me personally? Do I see a resolution that would allow me to fix it or continue in my role? Will it affect my future within the company if I stay? What are the outside opportunities that could show more promise or remove the toxic situation? I would recommend speaking to your supervisor or manager, potentially HR representatives, trusted family member to discuss what the possible resolutions might be. However, if it's affecting your health, you're not sleeping, you have high anxiety, you should speak to a therapist, try and work out those things, gain coping strategies for the interim, and then determine your best path forward, whether that is leaving the company, if you can't get a resolution internally, that's good for everyone?

 

Bethany: Yeah, no, that's so interesting. And this isn't about like a toxic environment, but more of just like a note on, you know, doing what's best for you. And you know, I had a talk with a potential practicum student the other day, and you know, I outlined all of the opportunities we had for her, and I said, you know, if this is the right fit, like I'm happy to bring you on board, but you need to take the opportunities that are right for you and your career path, and, you know, build out your life how you want it to be, you know, and like, take the opportunities that are going to get you to where you want to go. And so I said, you know, here's what we have, if you want to join us and you're more than welcome, but if it's not the right fit, then I definitely understand that too, and I support your decision kind of either way. And I think you know, whether it's just a general life decision, whether it's, you know, a career change because of a toxic environment, or whatever it might be, at the end of the day, like you have to make decisions in life that are best for you, whether that's just a general career change, whether that's to better your mental health, etc, whatever it might be

 

David: I think it also means a lot to that person. You're actually mentoring them right there, right yeah, and showing them that you're actually interested in them and what they want to do and their future, yeah, and whether they take the job or not, you’re still coaching them to do what's best for them

 

Bethany: For sure. And just you mentioned coping mechanisms, and that's something that we talked about all the time in public health, is healthy coping. And so, yeah, I would say definitely. If you're struggling with, you know, mental health or stress at work, or whatever it might be like, it's important to build resilience, but it's also important to build, you know, healthy coping mechanisms and maintaining your mental health and talking to a professional. So thank you for that.

 

Finally, for this segment, our last question is, what are your tips for young professionals on seeking support from their bosses when needed?

 

David: Well, again, as we've said almost all the way through this, it's communication. Bosses do tend to have more insight on company issues, direction and decisions, and when asked, they may share some of those insights to alleviate your concern and allow you to focus on your tasks and be more successful. Your boss is interested in your success, or at least should be understanding their needs from a business perspective, can help provide not only guidance and understanding of how you and your department fit into the overall business, but allowing you both to share and successful and enjoyable work environment.

 

Bethany: Yeah, and I think that's another thing is like a good and supportive boss will create an environment where you can go to them with problems, and if you have a problem, they should be supportive, and their first thought or their first reaction shouldn't be one of like, you're actually the problem,

 

David: (laughs) unless you really are.

 

Bethany: (laughs) Well, you know, I guess that's another thing, but yeah, having a supportive environment is definitely important to that. And I think your boss should be somebody that you can go to when you need additional support or need to troubleshoot something.

 

Great, and with that, we will move into segment four, your favorite piece of advice.

 

Bethany: So segment four, your favorite piece of advice. So here is where I will ask you to share your favorite piece of advice you received in the workplace and how it shaped your outlook on resilience.

 

David: Okay, so my favorite piece of advice, I would say, comes from the movie Field of Dreams.

 

Bethany: (laughs)

 

David: “Build it, and they will come” - relating back to what my one of my mentors told me, do the job, yeah, people will believe it, yeah, then apply for the role. Then people will believe it, and you'll get the job. Always working to improve yourself, whether that is stretching your role outside of the defined will doing a little bit extra in other areas, as long as it's supportive, is building your understanding and building your resilience and building your reputation across the company as somebody of honesty and integrity. And I think that's the key to successful career.

 

Bethany: Awesome. So, yeah, no, I know you were saying about, for those promotions you got, you know, do the role before you get the role kind of thing.

 

David: You know, it's surprising how well that works. When you do go in and you say, Well, I'm playing for this job and but you're already doing it, yeah? And you go, Well, yeah. And it's like, Well, okay, it's kind of a no brainer. Then, yeah, yeah, because we already know you know how to do it.

 

Bethany: And, yeah, some key themes there in that final piece of advice. You know, I know you're talking about clear communication, honesty, sounds like transparency at work as well. All really good things to take away. And again, building resilience is not, you know, an overnight thing. It's not one big event that gets you there, but it's, you know, pivoting. It's small accumulations of things over time and building that mental strength and resilience.

 

David: (laughs) And I think it actually sets you up well for retirement.

 

Bethany: (laughs) Why is that?

 

David: Because things don't bother you as much anymore.

 

Bethany: (laughs) Good to know. Good piece of advice there. Well, David, thank you so much for joining us today, and stay tuned next time everybody for our next episode of building resilience. Thank you, David.

 

David: You’re welcome

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Sources Used: 

“Gentle pop song for podcast, intro and outro music” prompt. Suno AI, 4 Oct 2024. Version V4, https://suno.com/.

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“Red headed woman interviewing man with glasses for podcast” CANVA AI. 2024 version. 14 October 2024. https://www.canva.com/

 

Rev AI. 2024 version. 24 November 2024. https://www.rev.com/services/ai-transcription

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